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Angus Ross
Welcome to Rewilding Love this season is with a couple on the brink of divorce.
Rohini Ross
This is episode number 27 with Steve Adair.
Steve Adair
I really feel I've been asked to have a voice. And I feel the voice for me is to be sharing within the LGBT community or the gaming community.
Rohini Ross
This understanding helps people to connect with the truth that's inside of themselves so that there isn't that feeling of shame or needing to hide
Steve Adair
The moment that they feel. There is no judgment there without you even saying a word, something special happens within them.
Angus Ross
We're all in this together. We're all brothers and sisters together,
Steve Adair
They begin to wake up to wisdom.
Rohini Ross
It feels miraculous to me what can happen when people tap into that space within themselves
Steve Adair
Refine a sense for nature, where peace of mind where truth provides, where hope provides,
Rohini Ross
The healing happens through the connection with something deeper within ourselves where the peace actually resides.
Angus Ross
Doesn't have to be pretty, but it will be honest, and it will be healing.
Steve Adair
That's what rewilding is, we're rely on naturally to let loose, and just see what happens between the conversation between love between wherever
Angus Ross
You are listening to Rewilding Love with me, Angus Ross,
Rohini Ross
And me Rohini Ross
Angus Ross
Rewilding Love is a podcast about relationships.
Rohini Ross
We believe that love never disappears completely in relationships. It can always be rewilded
Angus Ross
Listen in, as we speak with our guests about how they share the understanding behind the rewilding metaphor in their work,
Rohini Ross
And how it has helped them in their relationships.
Angus Ross
Relax and enjoy the show. On today's podcast, we're going to be talking to the wonderful Steve Adair, who is really quite an incredible man. And amongst other things, he is the three principles mentor, a soul coach, a Reiki Master and a psychotherapist. Quite the smorgasbord of the mental health field, I would say.
Rohini Ross
Absolutely. And I'm glad that you figured out how to say that word. I'm not going to even attempt to dance. In addition to all of those things, Steve is also an international speaker, trainer, coach and mentor. And he's worked all over the world. And he does have a private practice that's based in central Bedfordshire.
Angus Ross
Yeah, I mean, he's, he's the consummate Renaissance man, I'd say. And, as a renaissance man, what I really love about him is that in all areas, in all fields of which he is, as I say, the consummate expert, he seems to lead with love. And for those of you who are listening to this podcast, who are less spiritually inclined, and think that sounds really woowoo, as I'm sure I would have done, when I first stepped on the shores many moons ago. That, for me, is the one way where you really connect with another human being. So if you're going to be in the mental health field, that has to be where you start. And he wants to lead the charge every step of the way. In that respect, as far as I can tell,
Rohini Ross
I think it's really beautiful, how he is really clear that he is simply creating a space for the Nate health and wellbeing to come forward within his client, and for the client to become aware of that for themselves. And that he's not putting anything in there. And I think that's the same premise that we work from, is that everybody has that innate well being peace of mind, natural state of love within themselves. But we just get caught up and forget. And have an experience that's different than that. And because our experience isn't reflecting that in the moment, we don't realize how close it is and how easy it is to get back to that space within ourselves.
Angus Ross
Yeah. And it creates inevitably a really safe container where people feel like they can really allow themselves to be honest.
Rohini Ross
I think it really points to the simplicity of the work of helping people connect with their mental health. What Steve was saying, and I think what we would agree with us, but it's not about technique, it's not about strategy. It's really about creating that space of love. So that that can be drawn out from within.
Angus Ross
All you need is love, love, love is all you need.
Rohini Ross
Their ears aren't bleeding after listening to that,
Angus Ross
Take it away, Steve.
Rohini Ross
In terms of our podcast, we started off the season, we recorded a couple's intensive Angus. And I did and we basically took excerpts of that intensive to then use as a way to illustrate teaching points regarding relationship and regarding a spiritual understanding that really helps people to have more ease in their relationships to have more graceful experience. And I know that you've been in your relationship you mentioned for 18 years. And I think that that's going to be something really wonderful for us to talk about. Because any relationship has its ups and downs, its challenges, its learning curves. And I think that we learn so much from each other. And also, we'd love to hear about the work that you're doing. My understanding is that you also do work with your partner and or have done over the years. And so I think Angus and I are working partners. So it's always interesting when we add that to the mix, so I'm sure there's gonna be lots to explore. And, and as we talked about, before, we were recording, as I said, let’s get recording is that we're really focusing on having diversity and inclusion in the podcast, and really having different voices. And you know, you've been in a same sex relationship for 18 years. That's not anguses, in my experience, but we can learn from that. And there's going to be things that are universal, and there's going to be things that are unique to that lived experience. And so I see it as an opportunity for greater understanding, and greater learning for us as we participate. And then for our listeners as well.
Angus Ross
Yeah, I'm so looking forward to having this conversation. I've heard such good things about you. And already and the fact that we weren't recording our opening conversation. I feel like I can't wait to dive into this. I feel like what you're already you know, what you're seeing and what you're striving for, in my mind is spectacular. I think it's a beautiful thing. Thank you.
Rohini Ross
So just too sort of recap a little bit, we had been in conversation. And then you had mentioned seeing a series that I had run with a good friend of ours, Julianne Shazad about reimagining spiritual communities. And that seemed like that was also something close to your heart. So I'd love to hear a little bit more about what spoke to you about that program. And we can go from there.
Steve Adair
Yeah, sure. Um, you know, I think the word spiritual community is something that I kind of, I was brought up with the face, and I kind of my own way, so my spirituality to the religion. But I've always resonated more with the essence of spirituality, believing spirit within spirit everywhere, everything's energy. So when I saw your spiritual community in that it actually been, it was like, oh, okay, God hadn't planned for me this time. So that's why I reached out to us. And I really feel because I think a lot of my, in my, my quietness, I really feel I've been asked to have a voice. And so I feel the voice for me is, is to be sharing within the LGBT community or the gaming community. But when I looked at you as what I saw, I love the word diversity. And I love also not really the words to describe something, but really getting to the heart of the personal conversation. What's the experience like for you, because we can read on media about many things. But are we getting the heart of the person? So I was explaining to you that when Black Lives Matter, I reached out to my friends of color. Just have a conversation. I didn't know what the conversation would be. But I just felt I wanted to reach and we had tears, we had anger. But underpinning it was was love. Also connectedness of maybe ways that Gosh, I quite didn't see it that way. Or bust in my own bubbles of how I thought I was okay. And it's like, oh, actually, now that you say that. I remember. Many moons ago when I started ocean about maybe about 27 years ago, when I first did my very first counseling, I'm training and we were actually looking at diversity. And actually, it might be longer. But it was when Oprah Winfrey started being shown here for the first time. And it was actually looking at color. And it was something to do with the Redskins native people not wanting that to be used. So we were put into client observer on the couch, the court joint, the counselor. And we were asked to look at something diverse. So I was with a mixed race, black woman, and an Indian woman, and me. And what was really interesting as I wasn't coming from England, and I had a very broad Scottish accent. So the three was born kind of traditionally, even though they were born in England, I wasn't. And but it was so interesting on how we assumed at that time, and I'd say some, you know, if I want to ask you, what should I call you, and this is, please don't define me. And that that was really a while. So let's really have this conversation. Let's really see how is your experience. And I think that's where we really get to the heart of understanding what it's like for people, or the spirit expressing itself. So that's kind of I know, it's different from what I say before, but I think that's the heart of it. And I think the so many of us out there in the world, who are feeling called that wake up to step forward. And that's what I loved about your communities. That were you were reaching, and when I kind of read the BIOS, it was like, oh, okay, I need to reach out and ask, are you doing this again? Yeah.
Rohini Ross
When you said that you feel a calling to have a voice and to be heard within the LGBTQ community. I'd love we'd love to hear more about that. And what that is, and what you feel you want to share there?
Steve Adair
Sure. You know, um, so I've been with 20 on the 24th of June, this year, it'll be 18 years.
Rohini Ross
Happy early anniversary.
Steve Adair
Thank you. And I'm really there I see privileged, but I certainly mean I, when you say the word soul mate, we have so many different kinds of but I really know that this is someone for me that our heart really sings the same song. And even though there's different tunes, sometimes we really kind of, I think the harmonizing is more. But I know from childhood, and when we listen to Tony's experience, in my experience, it's kind of similar but very different at the same time, but there's a lot of suppression in there. There's a lot of still hiding from self in there. And I know a lot of is what I said I was brought with the religion. So I always wanted to be a good Catholic Boy, that goes against the religion, having a spiritual kind of leaning goes against the religion. Identifying as gay goes against everything that I kind of believed in, up top of my thinking, I started around about the age of 14, seeing something quite differently, yet, I didn't understand what it was, until I heard the very first time on saltspring Island, when I fell out of that thinking. And in that moment, I really saw how I know I can't speak for every gay man, it's actually out there. But I've worked in sexual health as a volunteer, and then they created a post and I worked, supporting people living with HIV and AIDS. And then went on to work for a large the largest sexual health charity in in Europe. And there was still that scene there of dysfunction. Not all gay men, but obviously, the men that we were targeting and so on, and I just saw that if they could see their inside out nature really shining through and, and a lot of the thing, and I've done it, and a lot of people actually do it, where I bought my way into happiness, and I've done different things and so on. But I've always known that behind all that. That's not what brings me happiness. So I did start. I think it was five years ago, actually talking to I went to speak at one of the three PGC conferences in Minneapolis, and over lunch speaking to this. So what are you doing what you're thinking of doing? That's when I started voicing is actually I know someone in the UK that you might be able to speak to. And it really tickled me because here's me having to fly to marry someone in London who is in a triathlete doing the same as me. And so we started having conversations along with Tony and we did start running men's group in London. I've really just, you know, getting that conversation just actually flowing and rolling it coming along guys and coming learn from my eyes. Let's start sharing wisdom, let's start sharing knowledge. How is it showing up for you? And let's learn from one another. And from that, then I do webinars with that. And my passion is I really I did men behaving kindly a series of podcasts. And I really know when to put my focus on bringing gay men forward, not just men who men who has maybe been inspirational to me, but also have a clear message to share. Also, because I think as many voices as possible, that can be heard, allow someone to hear something. And recognizing that it's we're hearing from within, but I know that as much as my ego, we'd like to think that yes, I know, all enough, correct, because I've done all the training you could talk for, I know that we're all vehicles of allowing people to understand themselves, that little bit more. So that's where I'm beginning to focus. And it's interesting, because I was saying to you, we're looking at moving house, and a key points in right when we move when we move. And it's like, it's kind of that expression, tell God a joke, so he can laugh at it, or so God can laugh. And so I don't know 100% what it looks right now. But the feeling is getting stronger when I look in that direction. So I'm just welcoming my quiet moments just to see what flows through me, and where I'm wanting to share that. But it will be globally, whatever I'm doing, it's just not going to be based here. I do want to because again, I think that we can learn from everybody else. And I think that's more exciting and to hear other voices, because we all have love to share.
Angus Ross
I so resonate with what you're saying. And I think that this is what's been so wonderful for me in the work that I do. And you know, I have been, I guess around this understanding for about five years. But what I've started to see more and more is, is that idea that no one has a handle on wisdom is like no one has a direct line to God, per se. So everybody has their way of distilling their wisdom. And I think that's what's so exciting. Everybody has their own unique way of articulating it. And there is always something new to hear there. So I think that that idea of diversity as Yeah, you know what bring it on, because I want to hear what everyone has to say. Because they all see it maybe radically differently, or slightly differently, or subtly differently, but they all see it differently. And there's always, that just presents so much scope for learning and growth. And so for the work that I've done, I love the point where maybe I'll have a coaching client and yeah, maybe Initially, I get to share some of my understanding. But the playing field quickly gets leveled. And then I feel like we're having a conversation and insight can show up for either of us. And I might even get more out of it than you. So it's kind of like, why wouldn't I want to look in that direction. And it's so easy for, I guess, teachers to put themselves up on a pedestal. But you know, we're all students in this together.
Rohini Ross
And I think he brought up a really significant point in terms of how this understanding helps people to connect with the truth that's inside of themselves so that there isn't that feeling of shame, or needing to hide, and you pointed so beautifully to how helpful that can be, especially within the LGBTQ community, because that can be an extra layer. Not that all humans don't deal with that. But that can be an extra layer because of navigating that life experience. And so I'd love to hear more about what you've seen in terms of your experience working in that community.
Steve Adair
You know, it's so interesting when you, you ask people, tell me about you. And we all have our stories, we all have our moments that we can say, Well, yes, this happened to me and I was rejected and I was this. But when you ask someone to just simply just sit down and just share where you are right now. It kind of takes people back a little bit because there's normally somewhere that they want the conversation to go to. So I just love actually doing that where you just get someone that permission. And even if that's just coming out with that edited, edited it because that's where they are in that moment. The moment that they feel there is no judgment there without you even saying a word, something special happens within them. And they begin to wake up to wisdom is what we were saying. And I remember the very first time, but it beginning I, I wasn't interested in listening to so because I was Phil. But I remember one of the things that grabbed me when he sees along the lines is his wisdom is the purity of thought before that, before the contamination and, and it stopped me dead. And I always remember that, that when I work with people, and so I like saying to people, like even though is gay man to gay man, I'm not the expert here. Because the person who knows you as being your best friend 24. Seven is you. And maybe like me, you've not gave yourself the best shot. And maybe like me, there's been similar stories that we can talk about, and the wisdom in those stories. But let's just really kind of share where we are right now. And let's just give whatever happens at giants. Because for a lot of people, it's like I remember at the beginning. I love talking about love. I love expressing love the best that I'm allowed to, and I can in that moment, but I know not everybody is. And I know sometimes when I will say that to people and maybe what kind of comes it's like the ball. I wasn't ready for that one. But there is still something exciting when we don't have an intention really, within conversation. And I remember the very first time that that happened to me when I thought I was having a coaching because I did fellowship with Chipman and Elsie spittle, Tony and I went over and spent time in Canada. And we were having a one to one. So I thought I was our egos were going to get when I told them what was happening, they were going to say, well, you don't want to do that, because that's ego. And it was nothing like that at all. And I remember when I left is like, Oh gosh, what was that all about? That was a lovely cup of coffee that we hired. And of course, it's so delightful that but what was that about? And I remember walking back filled with dirt, like oh, my goodness, listen to you, boy. There's no room for anything else. Because your charter is so low. And I'm walking through the forest. And I'm not listening to the quencher believes I'm not listening to the birds, it's singing along the way. I'm just stuck in there. So I remember those special moments, because I will cut to me enough. So I know when I just get in bed with people. And if they come with something specific, then obviously that's a little bit different that we might talk around that a little bit. But inevitably, I still like people having a conversation. And we just see where the conversation takes yourself in the moment. Just like when I was ready to come on here at four o'clock our time. I was like, Okay, I'm ready to go. Now. I'm ready to go now. And it's like, oh, why have we made up time? Why do I have to wait an hour. And it's like, it's so interesting, because I live in a village at the moment. And we live in one end of the village. And it just seem to get so busy outside. There was byesies that was the skill kids coming home. There was people like the back and was like, I'm not going to hear a saying, oh, Steve, there's nothing as loud as the noise is going on inside your head. So I always remember that that to be humble. Yeah, I don't know all the answers. But I know that they do. And that's what gets exciting. And that's opposite from what's it been like? What repression suppression? Have you heard? Have you been where you've been rejected? Did your family throw you out? We all have that kind of list of things that we can all work through, and identify with some and not with the other. But that separate science that makes you look very different from me. It's your uniqueness, your expression of life, but it still doesn't keep us necessarily on the same page, because it still makes you look different to me. And there's a commonality I think that we all share. And when we start feeling that commonality between one another, it's beyond the words that were able to express the experiences of what we had. And something magical happens there. Where we do begin to find I don't know if it's answers, but we find a sense of nature, where peace abides, where truth of glides, where hope abides. I remember I've always been a person of faith. I've always believed in something bigger than any of us. I remember one of the times recognizing it's like when you have faith, and I am a very hopeful person. But I saw them as two different things. But it's like nicely, faith and hope come together, then it begins to allow me an intelligence, that it isn't Steve. Steve expresses that intelligence. But the identity of who we've made up when we have faith in hope, allows love to be the expression. And if we just start talking about love, then it's so interesting where the conversation goes. And it's not always lovely. That's the interesting thing. But it's the right I don't know if you guys have noticed this, but it just seems to be the right thing in the moment. And then we don't have an intention of direction. That's the beauty and grace begins to dance with us and guides like never before. So it's really interesting when people say to me, can you write down what it is you want to do? And it's like, I don't know, until I know, I could try and write something down for you. But I don't know. And that's the same for the other person, it's there to
Rohini Ross
What I hear is just this incredible presence, that allows the unfolding of truth of love of knowing that isn't you giving anything to your client or doing anything for your client, other than holding that space with them. And in that space, the magic or the healing naturally unfolds. And that it's not through focusing, as you're saying, on life events or traumatic experiences, although we absolutely have compassion, we have I, you know, have compassion for that. But the healing isn't in the focusing on that is what I'm hearing you say, the healing happens through the connection with something deeper within ourselves where the peace actually resides. And then we can be with our life experience in a new way with greater freedom, less attachment to it, and more connection with that love that you're talking about. So I thought you express that really beautifully.
Angus Ross
You know, I thinking that Rohini, and I years ago, did a program here in Los Angeles in Santa Monica. And it was a two year program in spiritual psychology. This is before we were introduced to the principles. And there were, there were many skills and many tools and many things, many things that we came away with from that program that were really useful. But one of the first skills and they would call them skills that we were taught was heart centered listen in.
Rohini Ross
That's the second skill.
Angus Ross
The second skill, just shows what a bad student I was. Okay, well, maybe that was the greatest skill. And that's, that's why I picked up on it.
Rohini Ross
I will I will clarify. I was actually on faculty at the University.
Angus Ross
Okay. Well, anyway, but so for me, maybe at the time, I didn't really see the full value of that. But now in doing this work, I so hear what you're saying. Because, for me, to show up, to show up in love and, and to connect with that person on that level. And you know, maybe that's something that has to start with me making some kind of intention around that this is what I need to do here for us to have a beautiful conversation. If I really see you know, their loving essence. In other words, I guess I learned skill. But that's where the magic happens. It's like I can come in with an agenda. And here I am, I'm a coach, I'm a teacher, and I'm supposed to help you on that level. Really, you're going to help yourself, we're going to have this conversation where there is that sort of Beautiful Soup of love that we can somehow find our way into and, and allow ourselves to marinate in. And then hearts open. And then people feel like they can open up. They can be honest, they can explore anything, and it doesn't always, like you say doesn't have to be pretty, but it will be honest, and it will be healing. And I just think that that what you're seeing and what you're saying is so refreshing. Because that's where that's where my money the magic happens.
Steve Adair
Now, there's a little story. I was reminded of something that this morning. You haven't for two years now, but it's only for two, three years, we went over and did programs in Sweden. And the woman who asked us to come over, reached out to me to say that she'd spoken to a couple of people who've been on the program. And there was one guy so what we used to do is Have a meet and greet or a general open up to the public to come along and here is just talk on a Friday, and this one guy had come along. And she got a feminist that a friend had been to the program we did before, and his life had changed completely. And his work could change completely. And he says, you need to come along and listen to those guys from the UK. So we were like, okay, so at the end of the evening, I asked her in, in Swedish case, you just go and make sure that everybody is okay. So she, she was still kind of new to this herself. So she came up afterwards. And she says, oh, that gentleman. He didn't know what he was coming to tonight. He doesn't he his English is good. But he was really worried that he didn't understand where you guys was coming from. And he still doesn't understand what you guys are coming from. But he's never felt so peaceful in all his life. Can he come? He didn't know you were doing something tomorrow. And now he's getting stressed because he wants to come tomorrow and Sunday. Do you want to Okay, stop, stop, stop. Of course it can. I'm perfectly just check with 20. But I'm perfectly okay with that. And what was really interesting is that this gentleman had suffered a heart attack. I think it was the year or so before. And I don't know. And thank goodness, I've never experienced a heart attack. But he's lived in this kind of duty ever since. And he just got a glimpse that he didn't understand properly, the language we were using, I don't understand the principles. Well, I actually try not to understand someone's language now because I try and define it. But so I was like, you know, that's so exciting that you didn't get what we says, but you're left with the feeling that you, let's just start pointing towards that feeling. What is it saying for you? So rather than me coming across and saying, Well, actually, Yes, I remember, let me flick over three years ago, when I hear do spiritual or George Pransky. Say, this is what I want to say to you. Because the moments gone. How I heard at that moment is going and the ego is very good at regurgitating. And it's not always good at telling it 100% truthful. So I realize that actually, Steve, you're very good at kidding yourself, not being truthful with yourself. And you're spouting that office being your truth. And it was almost like, oh, my goodness, I've been doing that. And people were believing it. But I know. And I think I guess what you were saying there was it was from the heart when I was seeing it. I got to see really when I when I kind of fail out of my experience that time is I got to see that. The best that I could possibly do. I always done. And yes, of course, like everyone, we can look back and think oh, gee, if I could change it, that would be without moments going. But I know from where I stand now, I'm no longer on the back foot. I'm not no longer ready to how can I What do I, I'm firmly My feet are on the ground. I'm with the air. And I'm allowing the energy to flow between us in that moment. And that's beyond anything that Steve could kind of makeup. And I just love that. And that's what that guy saw in that moment. And when we had the conversation in this was just over Facebook Messenger this morning. But what was really beautiful, is it the beginning is that this woman, I don't know what to say to him. It's like just go from your heart wasn't saying, and now. She's beautifully coming from her heart. And he says, I'm still very confused over something. But I feel really good from speaking to you. And it's like, once upon a time, that just wouldn't have made sense to me that I'm still not feeling good, but I'm feeling peaceful. No, no, no, no, no, that can't happen. You've got to be one or the other. And it's like no, I realized, because I've seen that myself, where the storms of my thinking have been crushing. But my heart has been still. And it's just like when I remember, three years ago, Tony and I went out to India to lead a retreat. And in the dark, which is at the bottom of the Himalayas. And I remember one of the times walking around that little village we were in and seeing the vastness of these mountains. And then there was a stream here and when I kind of load my eyes the best that I could see, I could see the stream coming from way up top. And I was like a kid in a candy store because it was like how does it know to do that? Oh my god, there's a wisdom. And it was like Okay, I need to slow down because I've become so proud Scottish that Tony is not going to understand me different by anybody else. But it was just that wonder in that moment that really didn't mean a thing to many people but it was Just seeing all my goodness that's making its way somewhere now. And winter time, the dark can go down to minus 40. And the interesting thing is, they still, even though so this, this is going to be solid pack solid, but underneath that river is still flowing. And to me that sighs that we may get lost in there, the ice cube thinking, but we still have our heart flowing or spirit is still connected to Universal Mind. And looking that direction with someone, they get to feel that where it's a little trickle. That bond for me is magnificent, because that's what moved those mountains. That's what corrected those mountains to support the ocean, to support the river to get to the ocean and so forth. And when you start looking in that direction, it's like, let's see how we light up. Because what kind of is different from that conversation is that we're not talking about concepts or beliefs. We're talking about a word that you use Rohini magic, I don't know what that means, until we feel it in the moment where my Mary Poppins bag of experiences. Let me just dive in there just taught them and it just thought that thought, Oh, yes, this one, I leave it now. It's like it kind of sits on the shelf. And I remember when I thought you were everything that I needed. And it's like, you are going to get as dusty as you need to be because I'm not taking you off the shelf anymore. And, and that just allows me you know, we can talk about being humble. But it's different for him and humbleness comes to you. Too, to me, that is night and day different where you bow to the moment almost. And you never know where that's coming from the street homeless, or the homeless people that we've worked with. Like Angus Yun said at the beginning, where this was Tony's background and he asked me to come and run the program with them. And I was like, I don't know what to bring. And I remember one of the times actually talking to john Chapman. And she was talking about going into the prison services. And they'd asked them, and this is mean, this is how I saw it. If you ask john Shea will tell you a little bit differently. But what I heard in that moment was that the woman had said, so what is this married couple coming in here on a Friday evening? I used to really that stag what have you got to come in here? And I was a bit like, are they really said that to you? And she said, yeah, and she says but you know I find myself saying was like; I've never been in prison. But I know what it's like to feel rejected. I know what it's like to be fearful. I know what it's like to be sad. And if we start kind of just seeing that that's a commonality that it definitely experiences in our lives. We've actually hired. Let's just see what happens there. And I've always remembered that I've never been homeless, but it doesn't mean that I have to see that person as homeless. Just a little bit like we were talking at the beginning. It's like with diversity. It's like, yes, you can see the person. And how does that person want to be seen? How did they want to show up? That mixed race woman is that on my good colleague, a black woman or actually your house white? So what do you want, man? It's like, just call me back. And so for her, and then the Indian woman, it was like, Okay, well, I'm Indian, and I'm dressing with my traditional clothing. But yeah, just just call me my name. And it's like, Oh, okay. I was expecting that we had and it was like, No, and we really learnt that and it's like, so what about you? You're a white mine, but you're not in the country that you were born? How does it feel for you? I'd never thought that before. I've kind of just put myself into defining this is what it's like. And that really got me thinking but then it's like, actually, I'm ever been chased through time because I'm in a different country and has a different accent and the structure and things have a little bit of a kind of going and I remember I didn't realize that could run so fast as I did through the day. I was just quiet once I've got my breath micros like, Wow, did I run amazing with fear can do right?
Angus Ross
At some point, I think the last couple of years, humility suddenly started to be something that I started to really consider. I'd like to think that hopefully I got to a new level of understanding and that was something that I needed to learn. But going back to my early experiences moving to LA from England, one of the terms that I would hear is that we are a spiritual being having this human experience. And I used to think to myself, if I, if those words ever come out of my lips, take me outside and shoot me because I was so cynical at that point. But now I just say that's where humanity is, is like, there's the commonality we are this spiritual being having this myriad of different human experiences. And on that level, yeah, we can relate to anyone. And in that spirituality, I feel like there is the love, there's that sort of love, that soup of love, where we all swim in that weather where it's like, you know, like you say, I love that metaphor, by the way, underneath the ice have that, you know, that stream is running and flowing. That's the law, that's always that's coursing through all of our veins, as this spiritual being having this, these different human experiences, we're all in this together. We're all brothers and sisters together. And it's like, that's a really good place to look.
Rohini Ross
I love that metaphor as well, because it really ties in with sort of where we're pointing is we use the term rewilding love for the name of the podcast. And it's really pointing to how that that stream of love is always there. And we can just get so caught up in our concepts and our resentments and our hurt and forget that that's available. And it's not about love for another person. It's about the love that's within. And it's by connecting to that, that we get filled up and, and as Angus, and I say, we're not attached to people staying in relationship with each other. Our focus is on helping each one of the couple connect with that stream of love using your metaphor, and from there making decisions. But yet we see time and time again, how, you know, this sounds like a strong word. But it feels miraculous to me what can happen in a short period of time when people tap into that space within themselves, things that they just did not think were possible, three or four days previously, at the end of an intensive there. They're like seeing hopefulness and possibilities in a way that just wasn't available to them. And so just the way that you're speaking to it, I think, helps all of us to remember the direction to look in and to know with certainty the way that you're talking about faith in hope to know with certainty that that stream is always there. Even if we don't feel like we're experiencing it in the moment. It doesn't mean that it's not there. It just means it's very icy on top.
Steve Adair
Yeah. Yeah. I love that. When I read you, it's the rewilding, and that's something that Tony and I have really looked at for the last three, four years. And they're in the west of let me get this right. We used to live in Brighton, and it's about the West Sussex, have you heard of net or neat?
Rohini Ross
I have heard of it. I don't know much about it. But it's familiar. I think someone else shared it. Yeah.
Angus Ross
No, I haven't heard of it.
Angus Ross
Yeah, tell Angus, go ahead.
Steve Adair
So Tony had read the book. So it might have been maybe 30 years now, where traditionally It was a working farm. It was passed down generations. And then I can't remember if it was the woman's family had the farmer, the husband's. But basically, they decided that they didn't want to do the farm. And the farm was actually killing our ecosystem and different things. So they took a really broad thing. And what they did is they did lines that they hide, they've allowed just to go back to his natural state. And from that insects that were gone, have started magically coming by and butterflies are magically coming by the introduced wild boars, because that would have been traditional, their long hair, long horned cows, they've actually brought them back again, and they've allowed them to run wild. But the reason why I wouldn't share it is just Tony was reading the book. And it was like, oh my god moments that he was having. And it was so he would share some with me. And then I've kind of just gone with what we're doing. And then we share some more. But when we'd gone there, and I started walking around with them, and we had a little dog with it, and it had been very wet. So we had to be careful where we were walking, because these roads are what they were like years ago because if not tarmac them or nothing, every single but I started wanting to giggle and turn it I don't know why but I just wanted I just want to giggle and this is an I feel like when I was growing up in Scotland when we had the big rocks but we call them the little rocks. And when you were over 12 because it was I mean roid you could go to the big rocks and that's where we had paid and go steak and so much fun and all these kinds of things. But it's it's a how many years ago would that have been so we can The years and I just I just feel like the magic of childhood here. And he says that's rewilding. And in that moment, it's like, and that's when I read what you guys what these podcasts are. It was like, Yeah, because there's so many times that again, you go back to the stories to define it. But we've had moments of laughing. We've had moments of fun. We've had moments of feeling that 24 hours or a month long when you're a child. And to me, that's what rewilding is where we allow our naturally to let loose, and just see what happens between the conversation between love between whatever. And that's what I always what, when I look at the word soul, to meet sharing our universal love. And if we just get together Soul to Soul, let's just see what love wants to do with our
Angus Ross
Kids is so good. It just sort of like tapping into the unfiltered truth and being led by that. And I can I can so see, that's what you must have experienced walking around that farm.
Rohini Ross
Yeah, they live in that timeless space, like you said, 24 hours, I feel like a man think that real, just being in the present moment, and the fluidity of time is so amazing. And that's been.
Rohini Ross
Steve, do you have a little bit more time? To answer some of the questions that we ask our guests here in relationship? That'd be great. As you said earlier, It's so lovely to hear people's experience, and to know that, who knows what, what different experiences are going to touch people? So these are just questions about your relationship that really touched our listeners, it's just heartwarming to, to hear how other people navigate relationship. So and if there's any question you don't want to just tell us, you know, skip that one. So the first one is, what is one of your fondest memories in your relationship?
Steve Adair
Gosh, cliché, but there's been so many. Yeah, we know what kind of just came to is our quiet moments together. You know, we've done we've done so much together, and there's been some incredible holidays. And when I mean that, I don't mean it's like we've made this conscious decision is let's just be quiet. We just when we've just instinctively got quiet. So I think, too. There's the Walmart festival, world of music, arts and dance that we go to that thing it last year, because it wasn't on but it's back on this year. There's moments that we're where the music, you realize is moving you more beyond your thinking. And we've just looked at one another. And it's like kind of Oh, my god, they're incredible. And it's just that childhood moment, again, all over again. It's just everything that that's been very cherished. On that. So yeah, I think they're the kind of moments when we've not had any. Let's just go here and see and ended up coming. having the best time of our life. We had that yesterday, we ended up going for a walk with the dog, it was like we loved to just get in the car and see where we end up. And we'll find somewhere to park and then we'll just walk. And it's so we haven't got a clue where we're going. And we just love it. And they're also very special moment. Yeah. So it's kind of the moments where we're not kind of controlling ourselves seems to be the best.
Angus Ross
Yeah, I love that. Well, what is one of the funniest memories in your relationship?
Steve Adair
Well, actually, the one it comes to mind, which at the time, I didn't think it was funny at all, but I remember it was, gosh, I'm about maybe about 14 years ago on we've always loved walking. And we went for this walk and got lost on the way back. And and there was this river. And then was like I just this very thick pole going across it and I was like, I cannot get over this. If I fall in and out. He's gonna think I'm ridiculous. And he's gonna think oh, and it's like, I was still at the point where I needed to kind of pretend that I was a really cool guy. We're still in that honeymoon period of your life. And I did. And I was really pleased with myself. And then a little bit further, there was a little puddle and I put my foot in the puddle. And so even though it wasn't mean, my reason for sharing that was I put so much expectation where it was. Isn't this a wonderful walk? I wouldn't be anywhere else in the world right now. Until the river. So I think for me that was the funniest where I got to see how ridiculous I can do.
Rohini Ross
How quickly things can change.
Steve Adair
Yes.
Angus Ross
I thought you we’re gonna fall in.
Steve Adair
Well, I did too.
Rohini Ross
So the next one is, what is a difficult time in your relationship? And how did you get through it?
Steve Adair
I think real time I shared with you, we're hoping to be moving house. And we should have been moved easily two months ago. But the person that's buying our house is, I could see the word difficult to help you kind of look in that direction. And we have been, you know, it really helped me when I heard stayed talked about separate realities. And when he gave the kind of metaphor of the glass kind of lifts going up and down. You know, sometimes simplicity is really the easiest set of keys to click open, or understanding. And we've, we've gone through some, we joke, we're both fire signs. So we're friends, and then we're down again. And, normally, one is, and the other one is, of course, through these bits, there's been, where there's moments I've got completely lost, we need to we got to learn, and this kind of thing, and it's like Tony's just didn't watch me. And kind of just let me get on with it, and vice versa. And that has been the greatest gift really, is to realize that I don't have to sort Torneo I don't have to take on what's going on for him. And actually, being that in that space allows me to clearly see more what's going on for him. Whether it's just getting lost in the thinking or whether it is an award. So that was one of the times that I really wanted to pull the plug on at all. And and Tony says no, I don't think we ever it's like I forgot Sega we ever really going to agree on this. And I was hearing myself thinking, who is this? Who's channeling you at the moment? Because this is not, you're not heart centered here. And I just had myself send to Tony, do you really trust your feeling on this? And he said, Yes. And I knew that I knew them. Because that was a very different feeling from we need to we've got to be. And he just says it was such a clarity that I knew I could trust that. And so I think being open to knowing that I don't have to control it all, I don't know. And that we are in a relationship and a relationship is a flow of energy between. And that means that at times, I'm going to not get it, right. And other times I will and that will be the same as well. And it's not really about focusing on the right or the wrong. It's just what we're doing in the moment. So how we get through it is giving each other space, allowing each other to have those moments and realizing that that will pass. And then we'll get to a place we were at for whatever walks and Tony says I don't ever want to move to the barn. I know I could feel myself would. And it was just like, okay, that's this guy, right? If he wants to think that in a moment. And then later on, I'll pick the conversation up if it feels right. And of course, three, four hours later, he's talking about the excitement of being at the barn and what we're going to do, and it's that See, that's what happens when we don't engage in ego or intellect. The person instinctively naturally because of who were designed, we move along. And if he was stuck, because I wasn't jumping in there trying to sort out. And I'd be more open state of mind to be in a space to hold support, or whatever needed to happen on that moment.
Angus Ross
That' s profound. How do you divide domestic labor in your relationship?
Steve Adair
It's so it's so interesting, because hasn't happened for years, but has been in a gay relationship. It's like so Who's the man and who's the woman? Right? Actually, there isn't that we're both men. And it's like, so it's interesting, because moving house, we've kind of going into the roles that we've just done or the roles that we've kind of not necessarily are good at but enjoy doing. And that's been more helpful. So Tony will do them all kind of right. This is me and I'll go I'll do it. It's like cool. You enjoy doing that. And I enjoy tidying up and I enjoy get making sure and I don't know if that was kind of brought up with us. Scottish man that if you believe in a Harris has to believe Spock this with the little tail behind. So no one can talk about that that's what drives you cleaning mum and not that you want to be clean, tidy. So I have that little kind of buck thing going on. But I think you know, we just find her way. It's like when Tony took a little job over when we came here, when my mom was still sick at the time, working with adults with learning difficulties and our community near eyes. And we were eating mainly paleo way of lifestyle. And so Tony was mainly doing it because he was the thing that was in tune, it's like, so let's switch you on. So I'll follow your lead on that one. So then all of a sudden, he was out working, and I was the one that was going to be cooking and so on. And I started getting really creative and really excited. So then I took over all the cooking was actually happening. And we just were kind of naturally like that. It's just we find that balance of what we both enjoy. And even if it's sometimes Oh God, I really wanted to do that. I just see the enjoyment in his face. And that's good enough.
Rohini Ross
That's lovely. It's really, I think, helpful when we can appreciate the skills and talents of partners and say like, yeah, you're much better at that, like Angus can fix things. And like I would he's laid the wood floors down in our home. I'm like, I could not do that in a million years.
Angus Ross
Yeah, I guess it's about finding your groove. That's right.
Rohini Ross
So how our finances handled in your relationship?
Steve Adair
Well, that's interesting, because we both have our own coming in Britain as a part that the points kind of look for. And but then I see, that's really interesting. Because really, since we we've come along, and really got to understand that buying things don't define us, then we've become very simple creatures. Which means well, I see that we're moving home, and I'm already gonna get the nice things that we're going to be saying to Tony a little bit like, wouldn't asleep, really get across that wall? So, so we kind of, so we have a poll. And then after that around is around.
Angus Ross
What was the biggest misunderstanding you woke up from in your relationship?
Steve Adair
I think I own it a little bit before that I had to be the softer. I was the one that had to make. All right. That was really me feeding into my, I need to be a good little boy. Growing up. I'm realizing that with all the skills and the tools that I had from training, psychology, and it still wasn't working sometimes. We talked about the river when I realized I was pushing the river or trying to push the river and of course, you inevitably get soaking wet. When I realized that I'm not responsible. That was a big thing to recover from, because it wasn't just in relationship that everywhere. That really woke up to that when I saw that. My relationship to Tony is my thinking about Tony. That that's the real relationship that I'm having. I didn't like that at the beginning. Because it taught to me the separateness. There's like no, we're not separate. We're one. We're soul mates. And so I kind of did the Oh, traditionally what we think and I'm not saying we're not but it's I actually saw that when I stepped back that true oneness is where we reside. So me trying to look at wouldn't our relationship be better if we did this that we did that is just something that both humans seem to do doesn't necessarily mean that it is going to be better or worse. But when I woke up to realize that you're not Superman, Steve, you never were and you never will be. But you can be super in the moment. But don't wear the your underwear. I know I have the s in my name, but no, just don't do it. So I think for me that simplicity would it was just recognizing that I didn't have to buy it at all with relationships.
Rohini Ross
Yeah, and I love that distinction is you're not Superman, but you can be super in the moment and there's probably going to be a lot more super moments when you're not trying to be Superman right?
Rohini Ross
So what's one of the favorite things that Tony does for you?
Steve Adair
I think he allows me to be me. I think that really is my favorite thing is even my moments of me not liking me. It's just that he will he will look over and sometimes I like to feel this way. But then it just it does, it just melts me and, and what was really interesting is that when we got together because I'm the type of person I like to kind of show and so on and, and Tony's not as much, you will know that he loves you. And he cares, because he's a very caring guy. But my world in his world was like, so if Tony made you a meal, that was me, that was love. When I was like, Yeah, but I was weeping. To go with the love to me. And that was really something it took me a little while to get along, actually a lot of work to get used to because that was my condition. Love is. And so I think one of the easiest things is just allowing me to be me. I think that really is the greatest thing that you can actually give me just allow me to be me water.
Angus Ross
That’s the secret sauce in any relationship. Right? Yeah. Okay, well, how do you keep physical intimacy alive in your relationship?
Steve Adair
I think we do that. Because, again, it's understanding where the moment you know, I think it's like coming from go back to what we're saying, if you define a gay man, and it's like, oh, they're always out. They're always doing this. They're always doing that. And we never were in that camp. So what was really interesting is that when we actually came together, the the more spiritual intimacy was more important to it, because from that came everything else. For me, that's the simplicity of it again, it's like, that's the intimacy is that covers the physical that covers the emotional, the practical, the, it just seems to be where I was introduced to is kind of trying to tease me earlier on coming on and saying, Oh, so I'm going to be talked about and, and so Shauna, the dog, and it's going to be all SSI you. Like I said, Of course you are, is that what you're going to say? If they asked Mrs. I don't know. I don't know what I'm going to say until I know, isn't that what's happening? I see. It's like, but if I try and mark this one down, I must tell them this story, I says, but I don't know, he says, but what I will express is what I'm feeling in the moment. And that's how we very much work. And that way, they just go with the flow and normal.
Rohini Ross
And it's lovely. So one final question. If you could only say one thing to Tony, what would you want to say to him?
Steve Adair
See, my, my thing is telling me to so I'm just like, okay, I'll wait to see which one steps forward. Obviously, love. But thank you.
Rohini Ross
That's beautiful.
Steve Adair
I think Thank you stealing me more. So I will go with that one. Thank you
Rohini Ross
That's lovely. Steve, thank you so much for playing along with us with our questions. It's so touching and heartwarming to hear the responses.
Steve Adair
You welcome..
Angus Ross
Yeah, I feel so inspired listening to you. And the way that you talk about this understanding the way that you're using it the way that this understanding is you and the way that you speak of it. It's just beautiful. I just really love you. Thank you.
Steve Adair
Thank you. Yeah.
Rohini Ross
Thank you so much, that that's our word for you. And thank you and it's just been such a moving experience to sit with you here. You shared a field, the depth of love that comes through you. I mean, I've been feeling that as we've been sitting here listening to you, that's such a gift and a blessing. So very grateful that you're sharing yourself with so generously and I look forward to staying in touch.
Steve Adair
Me too. Thank you.
Angus Ross
Let us let us know how the Norfolk broads is an
Steve Adair
Absolutely yes, I will gladly let you know you'll be more than welcome to come and hang out with this.
Rohini Ross
What's the animal that's there?
Angus Ross
It's a coypu. Coypu is like this giant guinea pig like I was saying, but we'll see if it's still there. I will absolutely might be a good rewilding story.
Steve Adair
Yes.
Angus Ross
Indigenous species. So I don't know.
Rohini Ross
Maybe an invasive species. Yeah. Well, Steve, thank you. And thank Tony for letting you come on.
Steve Adair
Thank you for reaching out asking me I really enjoyed this. Thank you so much.
Angus Ross
So just as an FYI, I know that I mentioned this creature called the coypu that used to inhabit the Norfolk broads, as I recall back in the 70s. But upon further investigation, they were actually first introduced to that area by a local furrier farrier, phobia heifer trader, I guess, or a farmer, thinking it would be a great idea to have coypu in their farm and making for pelts or creating fur pelts or creating fur coats as the case may be. I don't know what they were used for. Anyway, coypu escapes and proliferates in the local body of water, which is the Norfolk broads and then subsequently became this enormous pass to the local farmers, and over the ensuing decades, was finally hunted to extinction. I think it was in the late 80s. And I think they were first introduced in the late 20s. And, and as I say, we're a real pest, particularly to the local farming community who, who are at that point or CLR, I guess. The, the farmers have cereal crops and I guess, said coypu had a real penchant for cereal crops. And so that's why the authorities said gotta get ready to go get rid of them. Get them out of here, Ron, oh, and so wasn't so pronto took many decades, but eventually all gone by the 1980s. Anyway, I thought I'd share that with you. Hope that was helpful.
Rohini Ross
Thank you so much for listening to Rewilding Love. If you enjoyed this podcast, please let us know by subscribing on iTunes. And we would love for you to leave a review there.
Angus Ross
iTunes reviews will steer people to this podcast who need help with their relationships.
Rohini Ross
If you would like to learn more about our work and our online Rewilding Community, please visit our website, therewilders.org
Angus Ross
Thanks for listening. Join us next week.